What I am learning at an anti-catholic blog

I observe :

  • that these things look like a “religion” to people who claim to be a-theist.

“Choice”
The Constitution
“Law”
“Roe v Wade”
“Science”
(They do not debate rationally about this.)

  • that others who are theist (of some sort or other) also hold some of these items in such fervent regard that they too see them as “religion”
  • that some cannot or will not discuss whether rights come from a common agreement that we collectively write called law or some semi-deity called “law” because perhaps they know the rebuttal to either would undermine their religion  (An instance would be that the word “born” in the 14th amendment means that no one can, should or ever can have rights before birth.  Another is that a baby is a baby in utero when the woman decides it is but is a fetus otherwise.)
  • that some honestly think that the bible says homophobic, abortion-condoning, Jew-hating things that are still required conduct for modern Christians especially Catholics  (Numbers Ch 5 is an example.)
  • that because some bishops, their chanceries and seminaries should have known better about reassigning pederasts and about ordaining homosexuals (and heteros) who are not demonstrably committed to chastity (agreed) and
    • that because some prevented enforcement ostensibly to 1) prevent scandal to the faithful 2) to rehabilitate the predators per then-current psychological methods but in part to cover their clerical backsides (agreed)
    • that bishops and the Pope should be tried in criminal court for conspiracy, fraud, sexual abuse and other crimes (disagree)
    • that because of this, the Inquisition, the Crusades, an evil perpetrated on them personally or  (fill in misunderstanding of history here) the Church has no business telling anyone what is moral
  • that data presented by a Pro-life person not only is suspect but moreover cannot be unbiased (an example is a discussion of the method failure and the use failure rates for NFP vs that of condoms.)
  • that sex is for fun and a human right and that any connection between sex and pregnancy is an inconvenient biological event like poison ivy or high cholesterol to be treated with medicine
  • that news articles berating the Pope stand on their own merits and cannot be debated based on the Italian, Latin or German original text that say different than the article
  • that “scientific” articles remotely supporting  abortion stand on their own merits and cannot be debated based on anything even other scientific articles
  • that any statement espousing a belief based on traditional religious teaching especially Catholic teaching even one supported by the evidence of science is not allowed in “rational” conversation

I do need to write what I’ve learned about pro-lifers.  They are of 4 sorts.

One kind who make one or two posts then leave because they don’t need the hostility.  (What does that say about me other than I’m not getting enough sleep lately?)

Another kind writes that “God will damn you all.”  One actually made no fewer than 50 one-word posts in reply to various posts; he wrote “Anathema!”  I wrote to him that we agree but he’s not convincing anyone.  (See www.deliberateengagement.wordpress.com/how-to-debate)

A third is folks like me; we’re not too numerous and we take lots of ad hominem comments.  I wonder if I’m convincing anyone either.

A fourth is a goad; they’re humorous and deliberately provoke the ProChoicers.  One used to address any prochoicer as “killer” conversationally not as a salutation.

I would appreciate any thoughts or ideas on how we can do better at this.

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6 Responses to What I am learning at an anti-catholic blog

  1. Ninja says:

    I believe that some pro-choice individuals think that most of the pro-life individuals write off those who have had an abortion. That is not the truth, as pro-lifers have worked hard to implement programs that support and advocate the healing from abortions.

    There is an aura given by some that while we have compassion for the unborn, we do not have compassion for the woman in post abortive grief. This is simply untrue but pro-choicers refuse to look past this.

    They may encounter one person who is angry for what they’d done, but we must find it in our hearts to replace that anger with compassion like Christ would.

    Rachel’s Vineyard and Silent No More need to be promoted more.

    On another topic, when you write “that sex is for fun and a human right and that any connection between sex and pregnancy is an inconvenient biological event… to be treated with medicine”.

    I’ve noticed that people use the word ‘have sex’ or other vulgarity commonly yet become red faced with embarrassment with the concept of ‘making love’.

  2. Matt says:

    So a little reverent respect in our written words for sex as a God-given joy would – using the term ‘making love’ – could stir a response in some hearts?

  3. Ninja says:

    It very well could. So many people refute love and deny the necessity in their lives. Thus to even insinuate that they are ‘making’ love is to deny the significance.

    The greatest gift given to us is love. Who gave us that gift? God. To accept the gift is to cherish it, but those who refuse God and His gifts, do not cherish the act itself. Therefore having sex is nothing, compared to the magnitude of making love.

    Does that make sense?

  4. Laura says:

    Ninja – I was just commenting on this to another friend –
    It seems to me that there are three rules governing “Catholic sex” – 1) sex is reserved between spouses, because of its unitive nature; 2) it is to be open to life, because of its procreative nature – but, also 3) sexual intimacy is to be approached with reverence – not only for one’s spouse, but also for the incredible Mystery we partake in, in our loving.

    That’s the magnitude, isn’t it? that it’s so much more than performing an act – but that the act means so much more than the procreative but depersonalized matings of lower animals.

  5. Ninja says:

    I have the tendency to believe that it’s open to life but you are also with that act, offering yourself and your love to your spouse.

    Offering yourself, complete and whole to your spouse with them offering themselves to you. A gift that exposes the soul itself.

    Who would I want to offer my soul to, than the person who is willing to offer it back?

    I also believe that if you don’t have fulfillment in a relationship without intercourse (sexual or not), you aren’t going to be fulfilled with a relationship with sexual intercourse.

  6. Laura says:

    YES! Exactly!

    So – I haven’t posted my experiences on the board, but I’ve discussed them with a couple people – the experience on that board has definitely affirmed my ideals and values – .

    Thanks for saying it so very beautifully.

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